加密飞行 Vol.9 | 世界作为社区的实验场：Timour＆Edge City

“这里堪称一个完美的培养皿。”

💡Editor's note/编者按

从十余年前的数学、计算机科学和经济学领域到如今的加密、人工智能和 Pop-up city，Timour 的丰富经历，似乎映现出一代青年极客的精神迁徙。赛博文化和数字空间并不是唯一的载体，伴随对实验性设计空间和共在场域的强调，他们决定在世界各个角落追寻曾经的加州梦幻之影。他对网络化社区和主权模式充满兴趣，希望能够通过去中心化的方式重塑社会协作；作为一个低门槛的开放环境，Pop-up City的演进运动为各式各样的社会实验和技术迭代提供了属人的“培养皿”。当社区成为一座绿意盎然的生态实验室，如此全世界都将是它所培育作物的试验场。

From his early years in mathematics, computer science, and economics to his current explorations in crypto, AI, and Pop-up Cities, Timour's diverse experiences seem to reflect the migratory spirit of a generation of young tech enthusiasts. Cyberspace and digital culture are not the only mediums of expression—driven by an emphasis on experimental design spaces and shared physical presence, they have set out to chase the fading echoes of the Little Californian Ghost across the globe. Deeply fascinated by networked communities and models of sovereignty, Timour seeks to reshape social collaboration through decentralization. As a low-barrier, open environment, the evolving movement of Pop-up Cities serves as a living "petri dish" for various social experiments and technological iterations. If communities can be transformed into lush ecological laboratories, then the entire world becomes a testing ground for the crops they cultivate.

此文是「加密飞行」专栏首辑访谈策划之一，来自友邻社区 SocialLayer 的 Eggy 和 Jiang。作为一群经常在各地巡游的 “飞行员”，他们所带来的独特视野，正是「加密飞行」所想要展示的：一群从过去降落，置身于此刻，并渴望着挑战和探索更好未来的远航者。我们期待着这种展示，能够飞跃语言与物理距离的障壁，成为未来加密公民同现实之间的桥梁。

This article is one of the first series of interviews for the "Crypto Flight" column, curated by the SocialLayer community members Eggy and Jiang. As a group of "pilots" often journeying across different places, they bring a unique perspective—exactly what "Crypto Flight" aims to showcase: a group of voyagers descending from the past, living in the present, and yearning to challenge and explore a better future. We hope this showcase can transcend barriers of language and physical distance, becoming a bridge between future crypto citizens and the realities they face.

Social Layer × Uncommons
Reporter: Eggy＆Jiang
Translator: Sevenfloor
Edit:0614

About

Timour Kosters
Co-founder of Edge City
Find him here: https://twitter.com/timourxyz

Eggy
Ph.D Candidate in Design for Social Innovation
Contributer of Social Layer

从多元实践到快闪城市
From Diverse Practices to Pop-up Cities

Eggy

What were you doing before you bump into this pop-up city event?

在参与 pop-up city 活动之前，你是做什么的？

Timour

I studied math, economics and computer science at university. This was about 10 years ago now. And in the interim, I've spent time working in a bunch of different fields,building startups, primarily in an operator role. I've also been community building for a long time in a variety of aspects. I've built communities, I've helped organize festivals. I've been playing music for a long time. So yeah, I'd say lots of different disparate interests.

That all kind of culminated in this pop-up city movement.I was an investor too. I was a partner at a fund called Seed Club Ventures. And through that experience, I was invited to help organize the AI Week at Zuzalu, which was a pop-up city event last year and that to me felt like a very unique singular experience. Because it really expanded my horizons of what's possible and I really fell in love with this type of event. 

大学时，我学习数学、经济学和计算机科学，这大概是 10 年前的事了。在这期间，我曾在多个不同领域工作，建立初创企业，主要担任运营者的角色。我还在社区建设方面投入了很长时间，建立社区，帮助组织音乐节。我也玩音乐，有很多不同的兴趣爱好。这一切在 pop-up city 运动中达到了顶峰。同时，我也是一名投资者，Seed Club Ventures 的合伙人。正是因为这段经历，我受邀帮助组织去年在 Zuzalu 举办的人工智能周，这是一个 pop-up city 活动。它真正意义上拓展了我的视野，让我了解到什么是可能的，于是我彻底爱上了这种类型的活动。

Eggy

There's a man told me just this morning that after doing this (joining Edge Esmeralda), he wanted to quit all other conferences. They only want to do the pop-up city event for the rest of his life. That's a big compliment. I really think that for lots of people, this is a revelation. So, what's the specific moment that you have this decision?

今天早上有个人跟我说在参加完(像Edge Esmeralda这样的) pop-up city 后，他再也不想参加其他的会议。在他的余生中，他只想参加 pop-up city，这是一个巨大的赞美，会给很多人带来启发。你做出这个决定的关键性时刻是什么样的呢？

Timour

I don't know if there was a specific moment, but I think Zuzalu was very special because it allowed me to really have so many different kinds of experience and felt very multi-disciplinary. Lots of diversity of experiences and I really enjoyed that and it felt very meaningful to me. So after Zuzalu, and honestly, I was burnt out after that particular experience. Organizing the AI week was so much work, but I just loved being in the environment so much. Yeah, so that's when I realized.

我不知道是否有特定的时刻，但我认为 Zuzalu 非常特别，因为它让我拥有了很多不同类型的体验，并且高度跨学科，我很享受其中，这段经历这对我来说意义非凡。老实说，Zuzalu 的那次特殊经历使我筋疲力尽，组织人工智能周的工作非常繁重，但我确实很喜欢这样的环境。我想我就是在那个时候意识到的。

Eggy

Did you have any thoughts about this kind of society prototype before you got involved?

所以在你亲身参与之前，你对这种社会原型实验有什么设想吗？

Timour

In general, I think I have a healthy skepticism of anything that purports to be a society prototyping thing. And that skepticism does actually extend to the current work we're doing. I really think we need to hold ourselves to a very, very high standard if we actually aspire to be something that meaningfully affects society in a positive way. I guess I was just kind of curious about these types of gatherings, but I don't know if I had a specific view on it. 

总的来说，我对任何声称是社会原型的东西都抱有健康的怀疑态度，这种怀疑态度也延伸到我们目前正在做的工作中。如果我们真的渴望创建一个东西，希望它能以积极的方式对社会产生有意义的影响，我们就需要以非常高的标准来要求自己。我对这类聚会总是充满好奇，但我不知道自己是否对此有具体的看法。

Eggy

You mentioned about you getting involved in the Zuzalu AI track to organize things. And after that, what did you do? What's the idea of the co-organizer of this Edge City? And how are people trying to make this happen? 

你提到你参与组织 Zuzalu 人工智能周的事情，之后你做了什么？作为 Edge City 的联合组织者方你有什么想法？人们是如何让这一切发生的？

Timour

After Zuzalu, I took a bit of a break. I went back to my actual job. I went back to Berlin where I live. And then I spoke to Janine, who's now my co-founder. At the time, she was starting to think about organizing ZuConnect, which was the second big event that we did with Zuzalu, the second big pop-up village. And so, I joined the team to organize it from kind of the core team perspective. And again, an amazing experience at a great time. We did this in Istanbul. 

So after that, after ZuConnect, we decided as the Zuzalu community to decentralize the idea of Zuzalu and make it more of a movement rather than a singular event and have lots of different people doing spin-offs and having their own attempts at organizing a pop-up city. And so we wanted to create something in that vein, because we really love this concept and love this kind of format. And we see the potential of it. I'm personally very excited about the potential of pop-up villages and pop-up cities as a kind of a design space for exploring new ideas about technology and how to live in community and et cetera. 

在参加完 Zuzalu 后，我稍作休息回到了我的本职工作和原本生活的地方——柏林。我和 Janine 进行了交谈，她现在是我的联合创始人。那时，我们开始考虑组织 ZuConnect，这是我们与 Zuzalu 一起举办的第二个大型活动，也是第二个大型 pop-up village。我加入其中并开始以核心团队的视角参与组织工作。这是一次令人惊叹的体验，我们在伊斯坦布尔（Istanbul）举办并度过了一段美好的时光。

在 ZuConnect 之后，我们决定将 Zuzalu 的理念去中心化，使其不再局限于单一活动，而是成为一种运动，让更多的人可以做衍生项目，并且尝试自己组织 pop-up city。我们想创造一些类似的东西，因为我们真的很喜欢它的概念和形式并看到了它的潜力。我非常欣赏它所表现出的潜在价值，在探索关于技术、新型社区生活方式等各方面的全新理念时，它是一个非常好的设计空间。

创新的原型：设计空间
Innovative Prototypes: Design Spaces

Eggy

I really like the word you used, a design space. Could you say more about it? Why do you use this term?

我很喜欢你用的这个词，设计空间。您能详细介绍一下吗？为什么使用这个词？

Timour

I think that ultimately innovation comes from experimentation. It comes from trial and error. And so, spaces that are well geared towards trial and error and experimentation tend to be areas where new ideas can form and be tried and iterated on. I'm a big fan of kind of bottom-up emergent change and innovation. So I'm always drawn to areas, the technology space more broadly is a good example of this, of just places where you can really experiment, and the barrier is low to try something to get started. People generally are open. They share learnings from across different teams, from across different industries.I think the blockchain space is a really good example of this, right? It is an experimentation layer for new forms of governance and economics and financial systems. And it has certain properties embedded into it. For example, lots of the code is open source. The community culturally is very open to sharing learnings and lessons with each other. So it’s a perfect petri dish for experimentation. And I think that creates a good design space, meaning you can try things out, see how they work, improve them, etc.

创新来源于实验，并且不断地尝试与改进。那些适合进行试验与反复试错的空间往往是新想法能够形成、测试并迭代的地方。我非常推崇自下而上、自发性的变革与创新，包括我自己也总是被这样的领域吸引。从科技角度来看，它是非常好的实践场所，你可以轻松地进行实验。在这里尝试新事物的门槛很低，人们通常都很开放，愿意跨团队、跨行业分享经验与学习成果。

区块链就是一个很好的例子。它是一个为新型治理模式、经济体系和金融系统进行实验的层级，内嵌了某些特性，许多代码是开源的，社区文化也非常开放，成员之间乐于分享。因此，这里堪称一个完美的实验培养皿。这种环境创造了一个很好的设计空间，意味着你可以大胆尝试，看看它们是怎么工作的，然后不断改进优化。

Eggy

So did you think the experiments you have been involving, like Zuzalu, ZuConnect and Edge City have met your expectation? Have they met the expectation in terms of being a design space?

你觉得你参与的这些实验，比如 Zuzalu、ZuConnect 和 Edge City，在这方面有没有达到你的预期？作为一个设计空间，它们符合你的期待吗？

Timour

Short answer, yes. We've already seen so many different ideas start to form, people coming with old ideas, or ideas they've been having for a long time and realizing, this is the perfect place for me to actually try it. Which I think is really cool. But I think one of the challenges for us is tracking the impact that we're actually having. Because people come to these places, they learn new ideas, they meet new co-founders or whatever, and then they go off and start new companies and we're not necessarily in contact. We're not really yet doing a good job of tracking all of the impact we've had. So yeah, it's definitely fulfilling the expectation of being a space for experimentation and innovation. But I think we’re still so early that we're only going to see where that goes in time.

简单的来说，是的。我们已经看到许多不同的想法开始成形，有人带着过去的点子，或者他们已经酝酿了很久的想法来到这里，然后意识到，“哇，这是一个真正适合我尝试它们的地方。” 这真的很酷。其中一个挑战是如何追踪我们实际产生的影响。人们来到这些地方，学习新的理念，结识新的联合创始人或者其他伙伴，随后他们离开，创办新的公司，但我们并不一定保持联系。在追踪这其中所产生的影响方面，我们目前做得还不够好。从实验和创新的空间来看，它确实符合我们的预期，但我觉得我们仍然处于非常早期的阶段，最终会走向何处，只能等待时间给我们答案。

跨主体协作的可能性
Possibilities of Cross-Subject Collaboration

Eggy

For yourself, what's your expectation in this society prototype you're trying to like having this achievement?

那么，对于你自己来说，你对这个社会原型的期待是什么？

Timour

I'm a big fan of this kind of bottom-up theory of change, I'm always skeptical of any strong top down solutions. I think we're giving ourselves the chance of emergence and seeing what occurs at the same time. Some of the stuff that I'm very interested in is new models for networked communities and networked sovereignties, meaning communities that start to really gain sovereignty and have some collective power essentially and communities that really are global. So they don't necessarily fit within traditional contexts of nation states, but they can be almost cross sections across those traditional buckets and can collaborate across country lines, which is very difficult right now in terms of anything meaningfully interesting and can collaborate and hopefully do good in the world. Next week, Primavera de Filippi will be hosting a workshop on exploring Coordinations, that's what I'm particularly interested in.

我非常认同“自下而上”的变革理论，并且对任何强硬的“自上而下”的解决方案都保持怀疑态度。我更喜欢让事情自然涌现，同时观察会发生什么。我特别感兴趣的一些方面包括网络化社区和网络化主权的新模式。这指的是一些开始真正获得主权并拥有一定集体力量的社区，尤其是那些具有全球性的社区。它们不一定符合传统国家的框架，但他们可以跨越这些传统的界限，形成一种交叉性。社区能够跨越国界进行合作，这在目前任何领域都是非常困难的。同时，我希望它们的合作能够在世界上产生积极的影响。下周 Primavera de Filippi 会在这里举办一个探讨Coordinations的工作坊，我非常感兴趣。

Eggy

I just went to Primavera de Filippi's talk. She's talking about building an AI intelligent monster, where different agents and humans can collaborate together. And how is the new mechanism or how the new organizational structure should be formed because now there are many talents that all work for the big company, but things will change since the agent comes up. So maybe that is a way we all want to collaborate with some of the agents and then what's the new form of this organization, this could be kind of new thing.

我正巧刚刚去听了 Primavera de Filippi 的演讲。她提到构建一个由 AI 智能“怪物”组成的系统，不同的智能代理和人类可以一起协作，这涉及到新的机制和组织该如何形成。现在许多人都在为大型公司工作，随着智能代理的出现，这种情况可能会发生改变。或许我们都能够与一些智能代理进行协作，这些合作会催生出一种新的组织形式，它可能会改变现有的运作方式，重新定义我们如何进行协作。

Timour

That's very interesting. I feel like historically, one thing I really want to study a bit more are just processes of centralization and decentralization of power and these are things where certain eras and certain times of history have kind of swung the pendulum in different directions. So just to give some very basic examples, for a long time, we had very centralized forms of power in the kind of later stage monarchies, for example, and then we had the enlightenment, we had kind of the breakthroughs of democracy, some kind of decentralization there, then again, centralization through the modern nation state and now through the internet, there's all kinds of directions, there's all kinds of like opposing vectors in this tension where on the one hand, information is decentralizing, anyone ostensibly has the ability to reach anyone else on the planet or even big groups of people with the things that they want to say, which is incredible. At the same time, there is centralization of the information silos or the information places. So this touches, what we're living through right now is this back and forth of again, decentralization, centralization, where technology is giving power to both sides. It allows us to coordinate and create networks of individual agents that have much more power. At the same time, it gives incredibly powerful tools to the current sources of centralized power, governments and some of the big tech companies.

这非常有趣。我特别想深入研究的问题是权力的集中与去中心化的循环过程。在历史的不同时期，权力的钟摆会向不同方向摆动。举个例子，我们经历了很长一段时间非常集中的权力形式，比如君主制，然后开始了启蒙运动，民主的某种突破出现了，权力开始下放；接着又出现了现代民族国家的权力集中化；而现在通过互联网，我们看到各种方向的发展，这种权力的拉锯展现出多种矛盾：一方面，信息在去中心化，理论上任何人都可以把他们想要表达的内容传递给地球上的任何人，乃至更大的群体，这是非常了不起的；另一方面，信息又在集中化，比如信息孤岛或者更集中化的信息平台。我们正在经历的，实际上是权力集中与去中心化之间的反复拉锯，技术为两边同时提供力量：一方面，技术让我们能够协调并建立起个人代理的网络，从而拥有更大的影响力；另一方面，它也为当前的集中权力来源——政府和一些大型科技公司——提供了极其强大的工具。

开源与自由、平衡与挑战
Open Source and Freedom, Balance and Challenges

Eggy

I always think about how lucky I am, living in this rapidly evolving era. We can witness so many thing. So did you encounter any challenges during your participation or your organizing this kind of stuff?

我总在想，生活在这个快速发展的时代是多么幸运，我们可以见证很多事情。在你参与和组织 pop-up city 的过程中是否有遇到过什么挑战呢？

Timour: One is that it's just incredibly hard work. So people burn out from organizing this. And yeah, so that's one thing. That will improve. We'll get better at this, processes will get better. We, like our team, just love it so much. So we have that innate drive. But when we help others to do the same or it's just very different, it's a different type of event. And therefore it's a difficult one. Yeah. There's infrastructure challenges, current infra just isn't set up for this kind of event. You got to manage the vibe. That's challenging. Yeah. Make sure things feel good for people. 

One of the biggest things, and this is where some detractors get or folks who are skeptical of this kind of thing, mentioned a lot that there's this thing around inclusivity and exclusivity, which I think is very important to be thoughtful about. Because we're very much aiming to be a very open space, right? Open space for ideas and participation and et cetera. At the same time, because it is a physical in real life event, there are natural capacity constraints. You know, there's just literally constraints on the physical space. So we have to choose who is kind of in the container and who is not, you know? And how do we do ticketing? How do we do applications, et cetera. And beyond that, we've also noticed that we need to be thoughtful about who's here just because it creates a better experience for everyone involved. So, you know, we generally look for people who are curious, and kind of brilliant or working at the frontiers of their fields. So if we get someone who's just really mean or just a complete asshole, it kind of ruins the entire vibe. And it's amazing how one or two people can really affect the whole thing. But obviously that's a subjective thing, right? Like we have to be to not let our own biases filter into the process. So anyway, the way that we, the way that we've been approaching this is just by trying to open source everything that we learned through organizing these events and therefore allow other people to do the same. Yeah. Like to organize their own events like this or to, you know, pretty soon there's going to be dozens to choose from. And then if someone's not a good fit for our one, they can go to a different one.

首先是这件事真的非常辛苦，组织者们都精疲力尽。我们会改进和变得更好，流程也会更加完善，我们的团队也非常热爱这件事，这成为了一种与生俱来的驱动力。然而，当我们帮助其他人做类似的事情时，这就成为了一种完全不同的形式，因此也更加困难。基础设施的问题也很重要，目前的基础设施并不适合这种类型的活动，管理活动氛围是一项很有挑战性的工作，我们要确保参与者的体验良好。

还有一个重要的挑战是包容性与排他性之间的平衡，这也是一些批评者或持怀疑态度的人经常提到的问题。在这方面保持谨慎是非常必要的，我们的目标是打造一个非常开放的空间——可以自由表达思想、参与活动。但作为一场线下活动，它存在自然的容量限制，物理空间的限制意味着我们必须决定谁可以参与，谁不可以，这涉及到如何分配门票、如何处理申请等问题。此外，我们也意识到需要对参与者的选择保持审慎，因为这样可以为所有参与者创造更好的体验。我们通常会寻找那些好奇心强、友善、才华横溢或者在各自领域前沿工作的人。如果我们遇到一个非常刻薄或混乱的人，整个氛围都会被破坏，这非常令人惊讶，一两个人真的会影响整件事情。当然，这显然是一件主观的事，我们需要避免让自己的偏见影响这一过程，所以，我们的解决方案是试图开源我们通过组织这些活动学到的一切，让其他人也可以效仿、组织类似的活动。这样，很快会有许多类似的活动可以选择，如果有人不适合我们的活动，他们就可以去参加另一个活动。

Eggy

I think it's pretty challenging that you mentioned being inclusive and exclusive because in many communities, you need to set certain boundaries and then the people will feel the belongings. Otherwise, it's fully open. Maybe people don't need to feel the sense of belonging and they don't want to contribute as well. So it's kind of challenging. I really like getting into this point. And also you mentioned about, if there's people in this container, but it has a very bad vibe and you will ruin something. So what's your experience about dealing with this stuff? Because I heard that many communities may be facing this kind of issue now. They have these rules about, if you touch this, touch this, then we need to let you go. But I think there will be other community members who think about why you have this power. You could kick off some of the people and what is the inclusive environment you mentioned. So how to deal with that? And do you have any experiments?

在包容性和排他性之间取得平衡，这确实非常具有挑战性。社区需要设定一定的边界，才能让人们产生归属感，如果完全开放，人们可能不会感到归属，也不愿意为社区做出贡献。你提到，如果有些人在这个“容器”里散发出很不好的氛围，就会破坏整个环境，这确实是个挑战，你在处理这些问题上有什么经验吗？我听说许多社区都面临类似的问题，他们会制定一些规则，比如如果有人触碰了某些底线，就需要请他离开。但这样一来，可能会有其他社区成员质疑，为什么你有这样的权力，你可以决定某些人被踢出社区？这似乎又不符合“包容性”环境的理念。所以，在面对这些问题时你是如何处理的？有没有类似的实验或尝试？

Timour

Right now, honestly, we are kind of attempting to be benevolent leaders in this whole situation. We're super early. We're just trying to get this thing off the ground. So we make a lot of those decisions, thankfully we haven't had to do anything crazy like kick someone out. But if we got complaints about someone in the community or something, I think we would just kind of politely ask them to leave. And we have some baseline policies around that, which we share and we'll act on. But over time, I imagine we'll kind of build community best practices. We can learn from the fact that we are not the first to do this kind of thing, right? People have been gathering for thousands of years. There's some best practices. We have a lot of friends doing smaller things, but more permanent ones or et cetera. So we can learn from them and take on their practices around community, conflict resolution and stuff like that.

坦率地讲，目前我们遇到这种情况的方案是试图扮演“仁慈的领导者”。我们还处于非常早期的阶段，只是试图让这个事情起步，因此我们会做出很多决策。幸运的是，我们还没有遇到必须采取极端措施，比如让某人离开的情况。但如果社区中有人被投诉或出现问题，我们可能会以一种礼貌的方式请他们离开。我们有一些基础的策略，会在需要时共享并加以执行。不过，长期来看，我设想我们会逐渐建立起社区的最佳实践。我们并不是第一个做这类事情的人，人类聚集的历史已经有几千年了，其中有一些可以借鉴的实践。我们还有很多朋友在做规模较小但更长期的社区建设，我们也可以从他们那里学习社区管理、冲突解决等方面的方法和经验。

混合环境：他们需要什么？
Hybrid Environments: What Do They Need?

Eggy

You mentioned about different co-founders of some projects or some talent, in this ecosystem, what else stakeholders in this ecosystem you need to face? Like the local government here in Healdsburg or like the local restaurant, the small business or anything else you want to share?

你之前提到了一些项目的联合创始人和一些人才，那么同样在这个生态系统中，你还需要面对哪些利益相关方吗？比如说，Healdsburg的当地政府、当地的餐馆、小型企业，或者还有什么你想分享的吗？

Timour

We're very thoughtful about the relationship with locals. They are a very big stakeholder in all of the events that we do. Here in Healdsburg, where we are right now, we've done a lot of work over the last few months to just meet the community, get them involved in various ways. The mayor, the chamber of commerce are all aware and on board with what we're doing and excited about it. We have an event coming up in Thailand in about four or five months. And then, so for that one, seven months prior to the event, we have already essentially had folks on the ground who are local, who are going to be as much a part of building this thing as we are. They even came out to our current event for a week for the first week, which was amazing. So it's just a lot of relationship building work. It's really important to do. Are there any tricks that you want to share? You just have to do the work and just meet people and connect with people and learn what they want and what a win would be for them.

我们非常重视与当地人的关系，他们是我们所有活动中的重要利益相关方。在我们现在所在的Healdsburg，我们过去几个月花了大量的时间与当地社区建立联系，让他们以各种方式参与进来。市长和商会都知道我们的计划，并且非常支持和期待。大约四到五个月后，我们会在泰国举办一场活动。因此，早在七个月前，我们就已经协调了当地团队，他们会像我们一样全力筹备这次活动。他们甚至在我们现在的活动的第一周来到了我们的活动现场，这太奇妙了。所以，这是一个需要大量构建联系的工作，没有什么捷径可走，你必须投入时间和精力，与人会面、建立联系、了解他们的需求，他们需要什么，什么对他们来说是好的结果。

Eggy

How about the local government in Healdsburg? What's their needs? What was their expectation?

就 Healdsburg 的地方政府而言，他们有什么需要？他们的期待是什么？

Timour

I think they just wanted to get interesting things happening in the town, they wanted to get some clarity and maybe some safety or some understanding of what we actually wanted to do first. And then going from there, they just needed to know that we weren't going to mess things up, that's very basic requirements from there. They're pretty open-minded.

我觉得他们只是希望城里能发生一些有趣的事情，同时希望事情能明确一点，了解我们真正想做的事情，以增加他们的安全感。从这点来说，他们只需要确认我们不会把事情搞砸，这其实是非常基础的要求。他们的态度还是相当开放的。

Eggy

I noticed that this event is Edge Esmeralda. So how do you cooperate with Esmeralda?

我注意到这次活动叫做 Edge Esmeralda。你们是如何与 Esmeralda 合作的呢？

Timour

Esmeralda is a project run by Devon Zuegel, who's amazing, and she has just been the most incredible collaborator. Her intention is to build a full-time permanent town called Esmeralda. And we are collaborating because she wanted to participate in our pop-up city and showcase what life could be like at Esmeralda. At the same time, she's on the Esmeralda side.

Esmeralda 是由 Devon Zuegel 运营的一个项目，她的目标是建立一个永久性的小镇，名为 Esmeralda。她希望参与我们的 pop-up city，并展示在 Esmeralda 的生活可能是什么样的，所以她负责 Esmeralda 这一部分。

未来社会共创：实验与协作
Co-Creation of Future Societies: Experimentation and Collaboration

Eggy

I think I already know the plans that you're going forward. So for the Edge City Lana, do you have any other thoughts on this kind of infrastructure for the pop-up city? And for this kind of community network, you mentioned this kind of new social network, like society prototype or new human organization?

我觉得我已经了解了你们接下来的计划。关于 Edge City Lana，你对 pop-up city 的基础设施还有其他想法吗？对于这种社区网络，你提到了新型社会原型和新的人类组织形式，还有什么其他的思考吗？

Timour

I think we're going to learn a lot in the next 12 months. Right now we're very much in the experimentation phase. I think what's happening right now is that we're doing these events and they are going to bootstrap these new networks of connections and communities and et cetera. And then when those communities form and they are excited about this new way of living and human flourishing, et cetera, then things will come out of that. That will either look like new network societies of some sort or things that we can't even imagine right now. So I kind of see us as like, this is a bad analogy, but imagine it's 2008 and the app store just got released and there's like three apps on the iPhone. And you look at that and you say, okay, what's going to happen with this? But what's going to happen is that it's like a design space for experimentation. And you could not have said at that time that one of the killer apps is going to be private taxi for everyone, private driver for everyone, right? Or like being able to stay in people's homes like Airbnb. But those things emerged because of the platform that they could be built on. And I think that's amazing. And I think that's what we're trying to create here, like a version of that kind of experimentation layer, but for communities.

在接下来的12个月里，我们会学到很多东西。目前我们还处于实验阶段。目前的情况是，现在正在发生的这些活动会成为新的连接和社区网络的起点。当这些社区逐渐形成，人们对这种新的生活方式和人类发展的方式感到兴奋时，就会有新的事物从中孕育而生，这可能会是某种形式的新型网络社会，甚至我们目前无法想象的东西。我打个比方，假设现在是2008年，App Store 刚刚上线，iPhone 上只有三个应用。你可能会问：“接下来会发展成什么样？” 实际上，它为实验提供了一个设计空间。在当时，你绝对无法预测到会有像“每个人都可以叫到私人司机”的杀手级应用，或者像 Airbnb 这样让人们能“住在别人家里”的应用出现，但这些事情因为这个平台的存在而逐渐涌现，我觉得这很了不起。我们正在尝试创造的，就是这样一种实验层，但它是为社区而设计的。

We just need to keep doing this and keep getting people to come and experiment. And two, we need to make sure that people know it's not just like a vacation, like we're actually want to create environments for experimentation and learning and shared collaboration, not just like I can hang out for a month with friends. So I think cultivating more of a builder energy is really important. That’s what we want to go！

我们需要持续推动这些活动，吸引更多人参与并实验；我们也需要确保人们明白这不仅仅是一次度假，实际上，我们是想创造一个用于实验、学习和协作的环境，而不仅仅是“我可以和朋友悠闲度过一个月”的地方。所以，我觉得培养更多的“建设者”能量是非常重要的。这是我们想做的！

Social Layer × Uncommons
Reporter: Eggy＆Jiang
Translator: Sevenfloor
Edit:0614

👇文中图片来源
X @timourxyz
@yaoeo

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区块链世界内一隅公共空间，一群公共物品建设者，在此碰撞加密人文思想。其前身为 GreenPill 中文社区。
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Social Layer 是一个模块化社交基础设施，旨在帮助全球范围内的快闪城市（Popup City）、意向性社区（Intentional Community）和分布式社群节点的运营、扩展和相互连接。
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